Kelly catches up with noted University of Chicago scholar Ayelet Fishbach to discuss her new book “Get It Done: Surprising Lessons from the Science of Motivation.”

This book really asks us humans to be way more humble than we are about what we know.

“We should acknowledge that our knowledge is limited, that we make assumptions about the people around us. In our motivations and often our perception of others, if I think that my spouse or my children would like me to do well in my career, then I will feel supported. Whether this is what they actually want for me, you need to ask them. I think they do, but you see the point.”

You also talk about making sure you’re framing your motivation correctly to maximize your chances of achieving your goals.

“We set a means when we say my goal is to apply for a job.  Okay, my goal is to find a job, but what if our goal is to have a successful career? If I said it too narrowly on applying for a job, I might find myself not motivated enough, you know? People might set a goal to save money and it is often more encouraging to think about what you’re going to do with that money that you saved. What is the ultimate thing that you’re trying to achieve with the action that is more motivating than thinking about doing the action itself.”

Another thing you note, that’s a common theme now on this podcast, is that we can negate our emotions when it comes to our thinking and our goal setting.

“In the science, we often see that emotions give us feedback. How do you know how well you're doing? You see how you feel about it. Do you feel good? That means that you're doing well; do you feel bad? That means that you aren’t doing well. And so the advice to put your feelings aside to be a rationale human being and not take your feelings into account, by research in motivation, that's completely false. Because if you don't pay attention to how you feel, how will you know how well you're doing?”

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